R8 Cars with Infrared fobs - future support?

Use this board for any non-technical club car related topic including motorsport, trivia, insurance matters etc.
rjessett
Club Member
Posts: 158
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:33 am

R8 Cars with Infrared fobs - future support?

Post by rjessett »

Hi, appologies for the long thread - there is lots of information below, but please stick with me as i'd appreciate your support.

As part of my work in programming fobs, and general support with T4 for members of this club, and the Rover Coupe Owners club - we have identified for some time an ongoing issue with cars with infrared fobs. These (I think) are typically cars made between 1992 and 1994 - they have two valeo fobs, and inside the car, the interior light has a small black "dome" on it. The Alarm ECU is the Lucas 14VT type.

These Infrared fobs are "rare" and if you want additional fobs, you have to buy "new" ones. You can still get them from Xpart - Rimmers list them, but they are £94 each. https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-YWX10005

However, just obtaining the fobs is not the end of the story. You need to "match" them with the infrared unit. This was done "back in the day" with the Microcheck diagnostics kit. This kit was time locked and you had to get special codes every year from omnitec to continue to use the kit. I have borrowed the kit to investigate, but no further forward as a vital cable is missing(!) in the late 90's, Microcheck was replace with Testbook, but there was a (now rare) Microcheck emulation module for Testbook, and the alter T$, that should let you program these fobs.

I do have the Micocheck emulation unit for T4, but have had no sucess in getting it to work (yet!)

In anycase, I don't think even if we program these fobs, its a long term-every day solution. So, I have been working on a new project. I have been working on custom wiring loom design, so we can do a plug-and-play (no cutting of wires, and totally reversable) retrofit of the later Lucas 5AS alarm system and fobs. These were very widly used, and can be obtained reletivly cheaply, and we already support these.

I have ordered the parts to make some prototypes, and they will be fully tested before we "go live" I envisage there would be a self-install option, or installed version (for a modest fee)

I'd like to know if this is something that people would be interested in. Im not looking for any commitments to order, just expressions of interest to see if its viable.

I see there would be a few options for this solution that people could order

1. A Cable that people can use, but source there own match 5AS Alarm/Fobs
2. Cable supplied along with a (seocnd hand) fully tested 5AS, refurbished and matched fobs (self-installed)
3. Cable supplied along with a (seocnd hand) fully tested 5AS, refurbished and matched fobs (non- self-installed) - this could be carried out at an agreed location, or even at car shows.

The cables could also some with options of

a) a diagnostics port so you could programme new, or replacement fobs at a later time
b) wiring capabilities to retro fit "flashing indicators", like later coupes, R3's
c) passive immobiliation - a little coil fitted behind the ingition barrel - the immobiliser turns off automatically in the presence of a fob (need to see if the r8 barrel will take the coil first)


Please can you let me know your thoughts on all of the above. I'll be honest, pricing isn't going to be "cheap cheap" - all the bits and actual time to do it add up, but the whole kit supplied in option (3) above would certainly be less than the purchase of two new infrared fobs from Rimmers and finding someone to programme them!

Is this of any interest?
crepello
Club Member
Posts: 2001
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 2:47 pm
Location: Herts

Re: R8 Cars with Infrared fobs - future support?

Post by crepello »

Very impressive, and commendable commitment on your part. These woes are a factor in my preferring the earlier cars, but the
whole fleet benefits if we can keep more of any vintage active, as there will be more incentive for ongoing spares provision.
rjessett
Club Member
Posts: 158
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:33 am

Re: R8 Cars with Infrared fobs - future support?

Post by rjessett »

Hopefully it will be one option to solve the problem (as well as being a better system)

I don't have an infrared car, so it might be a while before I get the chance to try it, once we do, will hopefully run it for a bit to see if there are any options.
User avatar
GTiJohn
Club Chairman
Posts: 6933
Joined: Mon Aug 16, 2010 7:01 pm
Location: Midlands

Re: R8 Cars with Infrared fobs - future support?

Post by GTiJohn »

Very interested!

Happy to offer 'guinea pig' services too :angel

Would it be possible to disable the OE immobiliser and replace it with the passive immobiliation coil you mention?

How about doing an install at the Retro Show in March? :cool
I like Twin Cams.... and Single Cams...and now Turbos
rjessett
Club Member
Posts: 158
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:33 am

Re: R8 Cars with Infrared fobs - future support?

Post by rjessett »

GTiJohn wrote: Mon Nov 28, 2022 10:05 am Very interested!

Happy to offer 'guinea pig' services too :angel

Would it be possible to disable the OE immobiliser and replace it with the passive immobiliation coil you mention?

How about doing an install at the Retro Show in March? :cool
Yes - this setup would replace the original OE Immobilser, and indeed add the passive immobilisation in as an option. Just need to check the Coil fits round the ignition barrel - you can fit it to early R3's, but no idea how the barrel differs between early r8 and r3. hopefully, not at all (or not much that matters)

Restoration show in March - thats an interesting option!

Ive got the parts and design to build the prototypes. Just waiting for the cables to be delivered. All the wiring for the cable will follow OE colour schemes to that in the original cars.
Last edited by rjessett on Tue Dec 20, 2022 12:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
rjessett
Club Member
Posts: 158
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:33 am

Re: R8 Cars with Infrared fobs - future support?

Post by rjessett »

Here is the prototype!

The extra white connector is a diagnostic connector, so t4 or pscan can program new fobs in if needed.

The extra wires for flashing indicators and passive coil are not yet present ( I don’t know how long it needs to be!)

Just needs to be tested now
Attachments
D076D18D-3CF0-4040-B1FA-AB1B27E3222A.jpeg
Topcat Tomcat
Club Member
Posts: 876
Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2016 10:36 am
Location: Worcestershire

Re: R8 Cars with Infrared fobs - future support?

Post by Topcat Tomcat »

As always Richard, very impressive. If I attempted to do something like that, I would probably start to get confused in the first ten seconds and give up within thirty!
Topcat Tomcat (aka Conductorwomble)

1990 216 GSi Auto 5 Door
1995 214 iS 3 Door - White Gold
1998 VVC Coupe - Tahiti Blue/Red Piccadilly & Leather
2001 1.8 Connie 45 4 Door - Wedgewood Blue
2004 75 CDTi Connie - Firefrost
ashy90
Forum User
Posts: 23
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:47 pm

Re: R8 Cars with Infrared fobs - future support?

Post by ashy90 »

Would it be possible to fit this on a 1992 car which doesn't have a factory alarm or remote central locking?
It does have central locking via the key blade though
rjessett
Club Member
Posts: 158
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:33 am

Re: R8 Cars with Infrared fobs - future support?

Post by rjessett »

Potentially, Id have to look at the circuit diagrams.

I've fitted a 5AS unit like this to my 1983 Rover SD1, and works perfectly!
rjessett
Club Member
Posts: 158
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:33 am

Re: R8 Cars with Infrared fobs - future support?

Post by rjessett »

Im pleased to say this was tested yesterday on a K-registered NASP Coupe, and it was simply a case of plug and play.

All the following functions were tested

* Remote Central Locking with far greater range than the original Infrared.
* Alarm sound when opening the doors (whilst armed)
* Immoblisation of car when unit is armed
* Volumetric alarm function tested, and fully working.
* Alarm LED flashes as expected
* EKA code could be entered by drivers door lock
* Added extra wiring to support flashing indicators on lock and unlock
* T4 could now "talk" to unit and thus recover EKA code (and programme new fobs) via additional Adapter
* The 5AS and cable "fits" in the space next to the original Alarm module (behind the centre console). its easier to remove the central console. (5 minute job) to gain access.

The performance of the replacement alarm system far exceeded the original infrared system

On removal of the adapter cable and 5AS, and putting back to original, the infrared continued to function as expected.

Im now going to work though the costings.

Although the kit will be straight forward to fit, and provided with instructions. Out of intested, how many people would actually prefer a fitted service?
Post Reply